The GW-Scripting list is a discussion list for information regarding the development and use of Window-Eyes scripts. Any subscriber of the GW-Scripting list has the ability to post on-topic messages.
From:
Richard G ApplegateSubject:
RE: Window-Eyes Script WritingDate:
Sun, Aug 22, 2010 2:20:27 pmKeith:
If I might suggest:
1. When one is asking for assistance one should never make attacks upon
those who are trying to offer such assistance. I dare say the fellow you
are attacking is probably much more knowledgeable of Window-Eyes and the
Visual Basic scripting language than either you or I. If you don't find
some of his suggestions to be helpful, you might indicate that in a more
diplomatic fashion as another person on the list has done. I too have a
vague understanding of the concepts of VBS and the Window-Eyes object model
as well as HTML and C++. Unfortunately, I have also been unable to
translate my vague understanding into Window-Eyes scripting abilities. This
is not due to the idiocy or stupidity of someone else's offerings; it is
because I haven't spent the time, effort and/or money required to learn the
material.
2. The members on this list are offering their knowledge voluntarily. Your
statement that someone needs to do this or that is false. Those who have a
working or better knowledge of VBS and Window-Eyes will suffer no ill
effects if you are unable to translate their offerings into useable
information. It may be true that you need things presented in a different
manner, but that need is yours. You may find their offerings of little or
no value, but how much have you paid for the information? I for one
appreciate all of the offerings of assistance made on this topic. Not all
of them have been helpful to me, in fact none of them have turned me into a
Window-Eyes scripter, but that doesn't mean the information is of no value.
My suggestions are also at no cost. If you can't use them, don't bother
responding just delete the message.
-----Original Message-----
From: Keith Hinton [mailto:keithint1234@gmail.com]
Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2010 7:41 AM
To: gw-scripting@gwmicro.com
Subject: Re: Window-Eyes Script Writing
What is all this nonsense?
I have worked with HTML a little bit. I know XML is similar, and I've
seen some XML files.
No thanks, I refuse to read your stupid idiotic Microsoft Visual Basic
Scripting HTMl webpage tutorial.
I am not stupid enough to read a stuipd dumb-idiotic document like that.
If the tutorial is not specific to Window-Eyes, and VB scripting, than
I am going to give up right this second, and there sin't anything that
the GW Micro staff, or anyone else can do to stop me.
I just totally refuse to read that tutorial you mentioned, so you
wasted your time in even attaching it.
Don't try to do that again.
Tom's right, and BT, you aren't.
Such a thing would totally overwelm somone like me, and it already ahs.
I agree with what Tom wrote, and not you.
Your speech example totally sucks. No offense, but maybe you need to
go back to Doug Geoffray and Aaron and have them hold your hand while
they walk you thorught he speak "Hello World!" or other such commands
yourself.
I don't think that Aaron, Raul, or Doug, would make a beginner read a
tutorial that had nothing to do with Window-Eyes scripting.
What a disappointing help this list has turned out to be.
If GW Micro can't do better than that witht he resources it provides,
than what is the point in me trying to learn when the very users I'm
trying to asks questions of decide to givem e links that I consider
pointless?
I don't use Outlook express, and work primarily with web-based emails.
I refuse to go saving HTML files onto my hard-drive.
No offense, but if you want to learn Window-Eyes scripting, I would
think that Chip Orenges examples in the wiki on part two are at least
more practical than the Microsoft VBScripting refference.
Unless this can be recitifiedd and I can really get a clear look at
how VBScript relates to Window-Eyes only, than you folks on this list
(and Tom this isn't about you or chip) it's your other friend who
keeps posting useless examples and links of refference to this list)
has turned me off completeyl from even attempting a simpol script.
All I can do with any confidence is something like
Speak "Hello World!"
That is an easy script. Anyone could do that one without even
reffernecing Chip Orenges wiki article.
I understand Doug Geoffrays example of VB script, I have an idea of
how methods and propertys work.
What I want is some tutorial or examples that teaches a user VBScript,
but specifically teaches you VBScript with WIndow-Eyes as the soul
topic.
Sorry, btu somsone on this list still needs to put the time and efort
into to creating one.
I'll help if I can, but that's my opinion.
I have no interest in doing VBScript for anything but Window-Eyes
itself, no HTML, no XML unless it relates to Window-Eyes alone.
I thoguht that some of the examples when learning the jAWS scripting
language for instance way back with JAWS3.7 well..the manual was a bit
too detailed. And the examples in the manual flew over my head. I
reached a point where I just couldn't keep learning.
Not that I didn't try, but once I began leeping into variables and
other such things, the manual only got more involved, not less.
Tutorials should not be super super complex to a beginner.
A tutorial for the beginner is what I am after.
Specifically dedicated to my point, teaching the beginner through
practical examples and stuf how to script with Window-Eyes.
VB Script is something I can learn by reading official microsoft
manuals, etc. I don't need a tutorial to do that.
I can always reffernece Tom's examples on this thread, Chips writing,
look at script code, and such, replay the only script recordings I
have.
As for attending GW Micro training classes, I've looked at the prices.
I don't have a job at the moment, and own't go into details, here, but
could never aford Window-Eyes training classes nor the phone training.
I don't make over 600 dollars a month and am on a fixed income for
those who really want the point blank truth.
I can't attend a Window-Eyes training class.
I work a little easier with one-on-one personally-and this has held
true thorughout my entire life. Not simply computer discussions. :)
If any of you on this list are interested on adding me to Skype, my
Skype ID is skypedude1234
Thanks for attaching what I consider to be point blank useless material IMO.
Unless it again, is dedicated to Window-Eyes and how VB script works
with Window-Eyes so that you can then write a VBS script for
Window-Eyes that will make an application work, then..who knows.
...well
, I've ran out of stuff to rant about.
Better quit before I enter chapter Nindy of the rant world.
On 8/21/10, Tom Kingston wrote:
If I might suggest:
1. When one is asking for assistance one should never make attacks upon
those who are trying to offer such assistance. I dare say the fellow you
are attacking is probably much more knowledgeable of Window-Eyes and the
Visual Basic scripting language than either you or I. If you don't find
some of his suggestions to be helpful, you might indicate that in a more
diplomatic fashion as another person on the list has done. I too have a
vague understanding of the concepts of VBS and the Window-Eyes object model
as well as HTML and C++. Unfortunately, I have also been unable to
translate my vague understanding into Window-Eyes scripting abilities. This
is not due to the idiocy or stupidity of someone else's offerings; it is
because I haven't spent the time, effort and/or money required to learn the
material.
2. The members on this list are offering their knowledge voluntarily. Your
statement that someone needs to do this or that is false. Those who have a
working or better knowledge of VBS and Window-Eyes will suffer no ill
effects if you are unable to translate their offerings into useable
information. It may be true that you need things presented in a different
manner, but that need is yours. You may find their offerings of little or
no value, but how much have you paid for the information? I for one
appreciate all of the offerings of assistance made on this topic. Not all
of them have been helpful to me, in fact none of them have turned me into a
Window-Eyes scripter, but that doesn't mean the information is of no value.
My suggestions are also at no cost. If you can't use them, don't bother
responding just delete the message.
-----Original Message-----
From: Keith Hinton [mailto:keithint1234@gmail.com]
Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2010 7:41 AM
To: gw-scripting@gwmicro.com
Subject: Re: Window-Eyes Script Writing
What is all this nonsense?
I have worked with HTML a little bit. I know XML is similar, and I've
seen some XML files.
No thanks, I refuse to read your stupid idiotic Microsoft Visual Basic
Scripting HTMl webpage tutorial.
I am not stupid enough to read a stuipd dumb-idiotic document like that.
If the tutorial is not specific to Window-Eyes, and VB scripting, than
I am going to give up right this second, and there sin't anything that
the GW Micro staff, or anyone else can do to stop me.
I just totally refuse to read that tutorial you mentioned, so you
wasted your time in even attaching it.
Don't try to do that again.
Tom's right, and BT, you aren't.
Such a thing would totally overwelm somone like me, and it already ahs.
I agree with what Tom wrote, and not you.
Your speech example totally sucks. No offense, but maybe you need to
go back to Doug Geoffray and Aaron and have them hold your hand while
they walk you thorught he speak "Hello World!" or other such commands
yourself.
I don't think that Aaron, Raul, or Doug, would make a beginner read a
tutorial that had nothing to do with Window-Eyes scripting.
What a disappointing help this list has turned out to be.
If GW Micro can't do better than that witht he resources it provides,
than what is the point in me trying to learn when the very users I'm
trying to asks questions of decide to givem e links that I consider
pointless?
I don't use Outlook express, and work primarily with web-based emails.
I refuse to go saving HTML files onto my hard-drive.
No offense, but if you want to learn Window-Eyes scripting, I would
think that Chip Orenges examples in the wiki on part two are at least
more practical than the Microsoft VBScripting refference.
Unless this can be recitifiedd and I can really get a clear look at
how VBScript relates to Window-Eyes only, than you folks on this list
(and Tom this isn't about you or chip) it's your other friend who
keeps posting useless examples and links of refference to this list)
has turned me off completeyl from even attempting a simpol script.
All I can do with any confidence is something like
Speak "Hello World!"
That is an easy script. Anyone could do that one without even
reffernecing Chip Orenges wiki article.
I understand Doug Geoffrays example of VB script, I have an idea of
how methods and propertys work.
What I want is some tutorial or examples that teaches a user VBScript,
but specifically teaches you VBScript with WIndow-Eyes as the soul
topic.
Sorry, btu somsone on this list still needs to put the time and efort
into to creating one.
I'll help if I can, but that's my opinion.
I have no interest in doing VBScript for anything but Window-Eyes
itself, no HTML, no XML unless it relates to Window-Eyes alone.
I thoguht that some of the examples when learning the jAWS scripting
language for instance way back with JAWS3.7 well..the manual was a bit
too detailed. And the examples in the manual flew over my head. I
reached a point where I just couldn't keep learning.
Not that I didn't try, but once I began leeping into variables and
other such things, the manual only got more involved, not less.
Tutorials should not be super super complex to a beginner.
A tutorial for the beginner is what I am after.
Specifically dedicated to my point, teaching the beginner through
practical examples and stuf how to script with Window-Eyes.
VB Script is something I can learn by reading official microsoft
manuals, etc. I don't need a tutorial to do that.
I can always reffernece Tom's examples on this thread, Chips writing,
look at script code, and such, replay the only script recordings I
have.
As for attending GW Micro training classes, I've looked at the prices.
I don't have a job at the moment, and own't go into details, here, but
could never aford Window-Eyes training classes nor the phone training.
I don't make over 600 dollars a month and am on a fixed income for
those who really want the point blank truth.
I can't attend a Window-Eyes training class.
I work a little easier with one-on-one personally-and this has held
true thorughout my entire life. Not simply computer discussions. :)
If any of you on this list are interested on adding me to Skype, my
Skype ID is skypedude1234
Thanks for attaching what I consider to be point blank useless material IMO.
Unless it again, is dedicated to Window-Eyes and how VB script works
with Window-Eyes so that you can then write a VBS script for
Window-Eyes that will make an application work, then..who knows.
...well
, I've ran out of stuff to rant about.
Better quit before I enter chapter Nindy of the rant world.
On 8/21/10, Tom Kingston wrote:
Well, I haven't a clue as to how I gave the impression I wanted to learn
scripting outside of Window-Eyes within a thread on Window-Eyes script
writing. But so be it. These things happen.
My point is still that this is all only making things much more
bewildering
to anyone interested in scripting Window-Eyes. I didn't read through youras
entire WSC code as I don't see the point. All the speech parameters such
pitch, rate, volume, etc. can be changed using the Window-Eyes object
model.
And we're able to control the synthesizer the user is using rather than
seeing what SAPI voices are on their machine. I guess we've somehow landed
in an apples an oranges orchard here. But that's fine. Obviously you're
trying to help, and I appreciate it.
I just think the bottom line is that the only true incentive to get folks
writing Window-Eyes scripts is going to be a comprehensive tutorial
focusing
strictly on just that rather than tossing endless abstract resources at
them. But I also fully realize that creating such will be an enormous
undertaking. The problem is that the resources out there, while virtually
endless, are a total hit or miss when it comes to what someone who just
wants to script Window-Eyes needs. And how is the beginner suppose to knowbe
what he or she needs and what they don't, not to mention what's going to
literally a waste of time. This is the quandary scripting presents. It'stools
akin to having the ultimate toolbox handed to you within which are the
to build anything you desire. But what do you do with a toolbox full of
tools you don't know how to use and haven't a clue as to how to build
anything? It's called the catch-22 toolbox.
Well, I guess we've run this dry. At least for today. Again, I recognize
and
appreciate your good intentions, Bruce. So thanks for taking the time to
add
your input.
Regards,
Tom
----- Original Message -----
From: "BT"
To:
Sent: Saturday, August 21, 2010 11:45 PM
Subject: Re: Window-Eyes Script Writing
Hi Tom,
Only posted that method is because you wanted to know scripting
outsideof Windoweyes, at least I thought that.
Your complaint is exactly what I complained about months ago when Ijoined the listing.
So, instead of reading what they had I learned .VBS code, wrote my own
speech as posted in previous emails.
This speech package is to allow speech without worrying aboutWindoweyes, for I found the same issues as you have and sincerely hope
thetutorial Chip is writing gets to be more in depth so no one has to jump
toMicrosoft or any where else.
The Methods you point out for windoweyes is true. The only differenceis
I use an instanced labeled as C and the dot after it is all the speechmethods used in speech; listed in the methods list inside the class.
GrantedWindoweyes uses only the word speech, but that is for speaking only.
So, I posted the actual SAPI format and how to construct all voice
parms. It is for both SAPI 4 and SAPI 5 and those 2 can be the same ifpercentages is used for both as you will see in some of the methods.
It would be nice to have a nice tutorial that goes from basic script
writing all the way into Windoweyes. I just gave you another approach tolearn some of the scripts, which still requires the formats in the
Windoweyes version.
What Chip last wrote is an improvement of what existed several monthsago. So, I guess it is work in progress.
Sorry about not knowing about your knowledge, just did not know...
Also, I never got a copy of the last 2 posts I made, probably becauseof
the attachment.
SincerelyBruce
I should also clarify for anyone interested in learning to script that
thisTTS example has absolutely nothing to do with Window-Eyes scripting. Read
itand be intimidated if you wish. Then realize that in order to makein
Window-Eyes speak you do nothing more than use a Speak command, such asthe following.
Speak "Hello world!"
In a script you're writing for Window-Eyes, that's it. Use the Speakcommand
to tell Window-Eyes what to speak and you're done. The method outlinedbelowthe
is for a stand-alone script to run independent of Window-Eyes by usingWindows scripting host. Again, this has absolutely nothing to do withscripting Window-Eyes.
Tom
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Kingston"To:
Sent: Saturday, August 21, 2010 11:19 PMSubject: Re: Window-Eyes Script Writing
Thanks for the lesson, but I've been programming for 20 years. I tried
toclarify my point in my last message. I apologize if my previous messagewas so misleading.
Regards,Tom
--
Regards, --Keith
Skype: skypedude1234
MSN Messenger: keithint37@hotmail.com
Yahoo/AIM/Twitter: keithint1234
Facebook: http://facebook.com/keith.hinton1
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