From:

 Baracco, Andrew W

Subject:

 RE: window-eyes and dragon Naturally Speaking

Date:

 Mon, Aug 14, 2006 3:58:32 pm

Keep in mind that the vast majority of blind persons are older, and may
have conditions such as arthritis and/or peripheral neuropathy that
would affect ability to use a keyboard, but these people may still need
or want to use a PC. Also, there are blind people of working age who
suffer with such conditions as rheumatoid arthritis, not to mention
trauma victims who may have sustained hand or arm amputations.

Andy


-----Original Message-----
From: Vaughan Dodd [mailto:vdodd@xtra.co.nz]
Sent: Monday, August 14, 2006 12:49 PM
To: Marilyn Dorn; Post to GW-Info List
Subject: RE: window-eyes and dragon Naturally Speaking

I agree with all of this, and just want to ad that the number of
programmes supported by J-Say is limited. You can email using Outlook
(for instance) but not Eudora. You can go to the web via Internet
Explorer, but not Firefox. Perhaps just a case of developmental
priorities.

Add to the cost considerations the need for a high performance pc so I
think the need for such a package needs to be pressing indeed, and when
looking at the old chestnut of external funding, blindness of itself
cannot usually justify such expense, particularly when in most
instances, good keyboard skills give the user much greater flexibility
to operate the computer in whichever way they wish.

Any links with Window-Eyes would have to be much less cost, and this
could restrict development of supported mainstream applications.


Vaughan.

At 06:26 a.m. 15/08/2006, Marilyn Dorn wrote:

Hi, gang!

If GW Micro would seriously like to consider getting Dragon programs
and

WE to work together, perhaps the company who makes J-Say could develop
the

same thing but to work with WE. They could call it WE-Say. Of course,
I

don't know if the basics are the same for WE as for JFW as far as how
the

third party software would work, but it's not something that WE would
incorporate into itself. Be aware, however, for those who don't

already

know the score for J-Say, Dragon, and Jaws, you need all 3 programs.
This

adds up to some serious money. The other drawback is that, if you
upgrade

any 1 of the 3, you have to upgrade the rest at the same time.

Personally, I find that Dragon and speech work so slowly together that
it's not worth the effort for me to use. However, if I needed it

because

of restrictions to my ability to use a keyboard, or if I had a learning

disability that gave me a lot of trouble writing and/or spelling, it
could

be a great advantage. In those cases, speed would be much less of a
concern. I'd really hate to have to use Jaws just because I needed

dictation software. My husband has Jaws and J-Say and Dragon Naturally

Speaking Pro. Each time I need to use his computer with Jaws on it, it

grates on my nerves. I love my WindowEyes.

Just my opinion...

TTFN,
Marilyn

At 12:58 AM 8/14/2006, you wrote:

Hi Ray and list.

A couple of points: training of DNS is stil required - there is an

element of hyperbole here, but I to believe that less time is required
to

get a basic training completed.

I do agree that perhaps GW could look at DNS, as there are blind

people

who just do not like the keyboard, or perhaps more importantly, have

reasons for not being able to use the keyboard: multiple sclerosis for

instance or diabetes where fingers have been amputated.

Still: the best aproach from my standpoint is some third party

partnership so that GW can still concentrate on its core activities.

Vaughan.

Kevin's experience trying to use Dragon with W-E is interesting, and
I'm not

surprised people are beginning to ask about this again here. It
seems the

latest version of Dragon now works without prior training although
there is

a facility to improve on its out of the box accuracy.

I do wonder therefore if GW isn't going to have to look at this and
maybe

bring on more advanced set file features or even a scripting
language, or

support for one. I wonder if the users of Auto Hotkey have managed
to get

Window-Eyes to work with DNS?

I've never quite seen myself the attraction of being able to speak to
your

computer as I am a pretty good keyboardist. Still, I suppose there
are

situations where you would prefer to have both hands free, maybe
during

transcription or some audio work. Even with audio work, I'd go a
long way

to avoid the expense of J-Say as, if Ill I wanted to do was start
recording,

pause and that sort of thing, then you'd think a footswitch would be
a more

economical solution. Either that, or maybe utilise the facilities in
the

APH recorder package.

I might say that my focus on cost is always more pressing here in the
UK as

JfW users pay a whacking import charge for JFW, and with that and the
cost

of J-Say - a UK product - few of us over here will fork out for this,

outside of those who successfully put an argument for it under UK
Access to

Work.

Maybe GW can come up with a more economic solution? I recall in the
days of

Vocal-Eyes Doug actually wrote a version of V-E that supported
dragon. I

somehow don't think GW is going to repeat that solution!

From Ray
I can be contacted off-list at:

mailto:ray-48@beeb.net

-----Original Message-----

From: Kevin Huber [mailto:khuber@sympatico.ca]
Sent: 13 August 2006 6:04PM

Hi:
A couple of years ago I tried to develop setfiles for Dragon

Naturally

Speaking. They worked to a degree but not nearly as well as JawBone
or JSay

do with JAWS.

First, I used the Laptop Keyboard Layout in order to allow the arrow
keys on

the numberpad function as they would in a non-screen reader
environment. If

I remember right, that will allow voice commands such as "move up 1",
"move

down 1", Move right 1" or "move left 1" to work as they should and
allow the

line or character on which the cursor landed to be spoken. I can't
remember

the details since it has been so long, but I used the DNS macro
system to

create other macros.

I hope this might be a starting point for someone who is interested
in

making DNS work with Window-eyes.

Kevin Huber

----- Original Message -----

From: "Vaughan Dodd"
To: "Josh" ;

Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2006 3:52 AM
Subject: Re: window-eyes 5.5 and dragon dictate pro/standard

> It is my understanding that Window-Eyes does not work well with
Dragon.

> It is true that it does work with Jaws, but this is via a third
party

> application called J-Say - not developed by Freedom scientific.
It would

> be great if a similar concept could be developed for Window-Eyes,
but I

> think some fundamental misunderstandings exist here. J-Say was
developed

> because people became aware that not every blind person can use
the

> keyboard. So: dictating to the computer, and getting synthetic
speech

> output from the same computer could be beneficial to some blind
people.

>

> I personally do not think that GW should move away from its
specialty

area

> of best screen access to computers for blind people, but as said

before -
> someone could offer an alternative to J-Say. It would be great if

you

> could have speech input coupled with the best screen reader
providing

> output so that there could be real choice for people who cannot
use the

> keyboard.

>

>
> Vaughan.

>
>

>
> At 03:37 p.m. 13/08/2006, Josh wrote:

>>Hi,
>>

>>How well does window-eyes 5.5 work with dragon naturally speaking
8? Can

>>you successfully complete the training process using window eyes
and

>>dictate documents into your computer?

>>According to what I heard the only way to use dragon is through
jaws.

>>

>>Josh

>>
>>Josh

>>
>>skype: jkenn337

>>email: jkenn337@kutztown.edu
>>aol: kutztownstudent

>>msn messenger: kenn6498ku@hotmail.com
>>

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Phone +64 9 278 4909
Mobile +21 784 856




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